UPDATE: Here is a functioning link for "You might be this guy. Requires a separate flowchart. "
Tuesday, January 26, 2010
Scrubs vs. Golddiggers
Some guys are cheap, but most guys just want to avoid attracting golddiggers who will squander their life savings and make their children take out loans to go to community college. Others have modest means but have a wealth of creativity and thoughtfulness to offer a special someone. Some women are golddiggers, but most women just want to know they're not taken for granted in a relationship. For further explanation, please refer to the flow chart below.
UPDATE: Here is a functioning link for "You might be this guy. Requires a separate flowchart. "
UPDATE: Here is a functioning link for "You might be this guy. Requires a separate flowchart. "
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The "do you live South of the Mason-Dixon" bit made me laugh darling. I hope you are well.
ReplyDeleteIf you are considered "cheap" depends on your culture. I have a friend who is German and she paid for her own bills the first few years of her relationship. Not because HE didn't want to pay for her meals but because SHE didn't want to HIM for HER stuff.
ReplyDeleteSecond, what happened to gender equality? Do women only want to be equal when it is to their benefit? Maybe they do, maybe they don't. Who knows? Maybe that again depends on the culture.
I agree that it is nice gesture if a guy pays for the dinner. But if a girl says: "I don't like that guy because he didn't pay for my nice dinner", then maybe she is not the right girl anyway. I don't think the woman should judge you on how much you pay for her but on how nice the time is she spends with you. If she judges you on the money, look for another woman.
Few girls honestly ever say, "I don't like that guy, because he didn't pay for my nice dinner." Most women think, "If he withholds this gesture, what else is he stingy with? Time? Affection? Attention? Let's see."
ReplyDeleteSince we have more gender equality than ever, women REALLY don't have need for men who don't make an effort. So if a guy doesn't listen and doesn't muster any creativity to organize a nice affordable date to get to know each other, a woman feels insulted to pay for a meal she sat through at a thoughtlessly chosen restaurant with a dinner companion silently accusing all women of being golddiggers.
Remember the night that we met, and you didn't offer to pay for my $1 hot dog? That was one clue that you only wanted someone to sleep with then. Later, when you first decided you wanted to pay for my pho, that was a clue that you actually wanted to get to know me.
Guys think girls are judging them on their money, when really, we're trying to get clues to how fickle you really are (because a lot of men are quite fickle).
bgs - If a man cannot afford a meal on a date then he should get himself together before he started thinking about dating. It's just a nice gesture to pay for the date. I'm not saying it has to be an expensive dinner, maybe a cup of coffee at starbuck with a great convo?
ReplyDeleteI cannot speak for other women, but I, myself would lose interest if I have to pay for my own dinner, after all, the guy expressed his interest and is pursuing me. I would feel that he is too cheap and not worth my time. And if we are up to go to the bar or wherever, I would offer to buy him a drink just so I don't feel like i owe him. Or if I feel that I'm interested in getting to know him more, then I would pay for a movie date at a later time, so there are gives and takes and not just taking. That's how I am and I'm sure most independent women like me would do the same.
your chart, coming from a techie, does not work. the way you have your chart, one can never be "sweet" by the first "no". :)
ReplyDelete(Cont from the last comment) lol
ReplyDeleteI think it's up to the men and women to be sharp enough to distinguish b/w a genuine person and a douche bag/gold digger.
Of course you can do research and be creative to come up with activities for your date. For ex, order a foot long subway sandwhich and go on a picnic date doesnt cost that much. Or order chinese take out and a bottle of cheap wine sitting out on ur front porch/patio enjoying each other company. If the woman ran after that date then she probably won't worth your time because maybe thats all you could afford for now.
As for men whom I dated that have always paid for everything on every single dates and even buy me gifts. I don't usually accept expensive gifts from a guy whom i'm only getting to know, thoughtful gifts are ok, but not expensive ones, because I don't know what his intention is and I don't want to feel like I owe him anything. In that case, I would plan a date to go to a symphony, museum or a movie but I would buy tickets in advance. Or bring him something I personally spent time on cooking or buying him a gift back that would equal the amount of money he spent. To me, that's equality...
But if it's just meeting up whether for drinks, lunch or dinner with a male friend, then of course I will always pay for my own tab.
K.
I know it's a nice to pay for the date, but I have to disagree with the previous comment. The guy shouldn't pay because he is interested in you. If you said yes when he asked you out on a date, you're probably also interested. If I invite a girl/guy on a date, you'll. But if becomes a relationship, I guess it's ok to split the bill every once in a while. And it's nice when the girl pays for dinner sometimes... Just my opinion :-)
ReplyDeleteR.
okay, my opinions are: if it's a first date, I think it's better of the man to pay for it. Even if you're a couple of teenagers. It's old-fashion and that's how courting should start. Later on, the girl can buy him dinner. Whatever it is, it should be natural and sweet. My husband pays 95% of the time, the 5% was when I insisted. That was at the beginning. Now I pay more often of course. Sometimes I just let him know ahead of time that I'm taking him out for dinner.
ReplyDeleteIt all depends on who you're with. One thing I can not stand is a stingy man. I use to date one. I PAID for EVERYTHING! If we go to a concert, he'll covered his own ticket and complaint that it's too expensive. So a man how loves you or a woman of loves you will do things for you without calculations :)
Its also old fashioned that the woman stays at home, cooks and cleans the house and gets slapped with a stick if she doesn't do as the man tells her to. Does that mean we should stick with it, just because it is old fashioned? Times change.
ReplyDeleteI agree with R. If a girl and a guy go out together then they do this because they BOTH enjoy it. Its not like the guy is the only one enjoying it. Why doesn't the girl pay for the guys dinner during the first date? I know it is old fashinoned but: see first abstract
So a man who can't afford to pay for a girls dinner should get himself together? So basically, you are only allowed to date a girl if you have some money. Maybe a girl should get herself together too before dating, if she can't pay for her own stuff.
@Ivy: The night we met we weren't even dating or weren't on a date. If you are hungry, you have to buy food. If I want to eat something, nobody buys me foo either. Well, you do sometimes but thats a different story ;-)
I just don't see this whole "great there are guys in our going-out-group. That means it will be a cheap evening for me tonight"
The old fashioned way is that a woman is expected to cook and clean and look beautiful all the time and take care of the children. The modern way is that a woman is expected to cook and clean, look and look beautiful all the time, raise the children, and work a full time job and be judged by a double standard if she expresses her sexuality. I don't see how this counts as equality, but I understand that true parity probably can't exist until scientists find a way to let men be pregnant.
ReplyDeleteAlas, I don't think any scientists are looking. Basically, until people stop judging women as sluts for having relations as freely as men and until men pick women for competence and strength instead of vulnerability and cup size, OFFER TO BUY YOUR FUTURE WIFE A FRIGGIN' HOTDOG, BGS. It's a classy gesture. Not everything old-fashioned is bad.
Amen, Ivy! Well said!
ReplyDeleteI said that earlier and I will say it again, yes, if a guy cannot afford a cheap dinner then he should get himself together before he start thinking about dating!!! I'm not expecting the guy to pay for everything, just that he shouldn't enter the dating scene if he simply cannot afford to pay for his date at dinner or movie. The guy just appears to be very cheap and stingy, and who would wanna waste time on a stingy person?
When I hear someone saying "Look at her, she is such a whore. She sleeps with everybody", It is normally a WOMAN saying that. Not a guy. So this double standard has been created mainly by women. Not by men. So I guess women have to figure that one out on there own.
ReplyDeleteYou werent my future wife at Tiesto. I think it is also a classy gesture, if a girl offers to buy a guy a hotdog. Whats wrong with that?
I will say it again too. If a woman can't pay for her own movie or dinner, then she shouldn't enter the dating scene either.
If this guy knew paying for a hot dog would enable him to sleep with you, he would have paid the dollar for the hot dog.
ReplyDeleteto BGS: I understand where you are coming from; in a today's society women are constantly complaining that they are not given the equality they deserve. So why not detour the traditional dating routine and split the bill or let her pay. However, I strongly believe that you belong to a minority group of guys (if you are in fact a GUY :) because most men would probably feel threatened if a woman offered to pay on the first day OR paid for her half of the first-date dinner. Traditionally, historically, naturally, genetically, physically men have felt superior to women for centuries and up to the recent times they have been able to express that superiority in most major aspects of life (i.e. jobs/careers, household etc). However, this has been changing rapidly as women gain more and more rights and acceptance. With this said, a woman who pays is just another reminder that the days of man's total power are long gone. Thus, for a male it might be very important for such a traditional thing as "the guy pays on the first dinner" to remain. Even if it is for the sake of his male ego :)
ReplyDeleteHi,
ReplyDeleteI know this is a bit older post, but I would like to in my two pennies worth, as well. I side with Ivy. I don't think that gender equality has worked much in the favor of women, but rather made it a lot harder to fullfill all these silent expectations of attractiveness, feminine role assumptions while also not costing the guy much and having a career on your own.
Coming from Germany, I must say that paying for your girl's dinner is something I only experienced a few times. (Well, gallantry is dead there anyways, cause guys dont even hold the door open when you have your arms full with heavy books.) So, I never expected someone paying for me - but I appreciated the gesture. I have, as a matter of fact, dated over 2 years guys that had always less money than I had, because I worked my ass off every week. It was never a big deal to me to have to pay mostly, because they guys could never go to brunch as they could never afford it.
Since being here in the US, I came to change a bit (of course this applies to Athens). As I have noticed it guys that do not spend money on you, are in fact only interested in quick sex without having to spend too much money on the girl. Even worse: When I paid drinks once, cause I just wanted to have good time, my date promised me he would of course make-up with a dinner or something - which never happened. And I felt a little taken advantage of. Also great: Last year I went out with someone and we decided to go eat spontaneously one evening. When receiving the bill he suddenly told me had no money and asked whether I could pay this time. WTF, was my reaction. There was no way for me to say no. I paid nonetheless, because I felt giving and taking belongs together. And surely the right thing is to make up for that inconvenience. Well,.... again I never got my money back, nor any kind of compensation or whatever kind of sweet gestured (didnt need to be money).
Ergo: No cheap dates anymore. I am always ready to pay for myself and I always have my card out because I dont need anyone to buy me food (@ Ben). Yet, if you have no decency and manners to at least signal that you are a gentleman and know what is appropriate and what is not, then you should not go on dates.
Dates following the first or so can be arranged differently - with me paying as well, because I dont want it to be onesided.